[Cressers]

Various ways of slicing the same pie and relying on second preferences to subtlebly swing the outcome to the preferred result, a 'muddle in the middle' favouring centrist coalitions.

[teeftwo]

Again wrong Cressers. Proportional representation is one vote for one one party. There is no second preference vote, theres no requirement for one.

Whether or not you get a centrist coalition depends on the overall political outlook of the entire country.

Anytime you want to admit you were wrong on the PR Referendum, go ahead rather than trying to style it out by saying anything other than FPTP is the same thing.

And who is to say a centrist coalition would be a bad thing anyway. Got to better than the clusterf*ck we have right now.

[Hermann's_no_hermit]

Again wrong Cressers. Proportional representation is one vote for one one party. There is no second preference vote, theres no requirement for one.

Whether or not you get a centrist coalition depends on the overall political outlook of the entire country.

Anytime you want to admit you were wrong on the PR Referendum, go ahead rather than trying to style it out by saying anything other than FPTP is the same thing.

And who is to say a centrist coalition would be a bad thing anyway. Got to better than the clusterf*ck we have right now.

I totally agree that AV was a very poor alternative to true PR and was the Tories' rather diabolically clever way of making out they had agreed to a referndum on PR but then producing a system that nobody would vote for. Give a Referendum on true PR and we may well see a different result. I do agree that some countries can't make PR work but many more do. Morally it is so much better than a system that consistently puts parties in total power with way less than 50% of the vote.

[bluetagagain]

There are various types of PR. In NI you can put 1,2 & 3 if you wish on your ballot paper.

[teeftwo]

There are various types of PR. In NI you can put 1,2 & 3 if you wish on your ballot paper.

Yes, Single Transferable Vote. Would need an expansion of constituencies in the UK to allow for the extra seats per constituency. Wouldn't work without that. Each group MPs would have a much larger area to manage. Wouldn't work here with current constituency sizes without massively expanding parliament.

[Smirnoffexpress]

There are various types of PR. In NI you can put 1,2 & 3 if you wish on your ballot paper.

Yes, Single Transferable Vote. Would need an expansion of constituencies in the UK to allow for the extra seats per constituency. Wouldn't work without that. Each group MPs would have a much larger area to manage. Wouldn't work here with current constituency sizes without massively expanding parliament.

PR would give a greater representation of voter opinion but, as you say, not in its present format. Westminster should only be about the top level decision making. At the moment we get a mandate given to us in Party manifestos. That is generally set by activists within each party as they are the most politically active amongst us. Reset the constituencies, and set up regional/ district assemblies that set mandates for Westminster to ratify, with PR at all levels.

[Tufnell_Chimes]

That’s not bad Smirns, the long-term absences of MPs like Geoffrey Cox illustrate how constituency representation is non-existent in some parts.

[Smirnoffexpress]

That’s not bad Smirns, the long-term absences of MPs like Geoffrey Cox illustrate how constituency representation is non-existent in some parts.

I’ve said it many times before, the current party system is past its sell by date. Representation has been replaced with five year dictatorships, the tail has been wagging the dog for many years. As a result our, still fragile, democracy has stalled rather than continue to evolve. The needs of each district/region are best identified within those districts and regions. Regional assemblies setting mandates puts all areas on an equal footing in the bunfight for funding from central sources. It would also allow for a more educated overview of the countries needs as a whole. The bonus might be,that as involvement with decision making becomes more local, more people become politicised and start driving us towards a future free of all the old baggage.

[firqdays]

HERMAN wrote:- "I totally agree that AV was a very poor alternative to true PR and was the Tories' rather diabolically clever way of making out they had agreed to a referndum on PR but then producing a system that nobody would vote for. Give a Referendum on true PR and we may well see a different result. I do agree that some countries can't make PR work but many more do. Morally it is so much better than a system that consistently puts parties in total power with way less than 50% of the vote."

And, twill be always thus Herman, i.e - If the system works for you don't rock the boat ! I recall going back to the 'mid 70's' when the LABOUR party were winning GE seats, with large percentages in diverse constituencies, voting against.

At that time it was the CONSERVATIVES turn to gripe about how a PR system would have affected the result in their favour !

And if there is a change in Govt at the next GE and IF .... ( in their dreams) ... the Labour party win in similar circumstances, you will not here anything from them about changing to a PR system !

[Tufnell_Chimes]

I think the rise of the SNP has screwed FPTP for everyone except the tories. Time for PR.